Ticketing 2022/23

[Kate Deller]

Thanks Neil, Ive started a thread, maybe we will learn something.

It could be time based, I know peoples lives are extremely full, work, family etc. Be good to hear why or if we can do anything that would help change this.

[Kate Deller]

Oh and for the record.

I point blank do not want to go back to accepting money on the turnstile in any form. The speed in which we get people in is fantastic. The system is working so well. The support we get from Kaizen is second to none.

And also for the record, there are so many really genuinely lovely people I have met and speak to there. You really do make the Volunteering worthwhile. Thank you

[Neil]

Rupert… say the club loses no more than four or five fans per game, which equates to around £1000 per year. More on big games. It doesn’t sound a lot but that’s say 1% of the average crowd? Obviously that’s a figure plucked out of the air, but it could be higher/lower. That’s the cost of convenience.

[DarrenW]

Waited for other comments before I came in.

Speaking from personal experience I took a old boy relative who we lost last year to games. Without me he wouldn't have had a hope of getting a ticket. No internet savvy whatsoever. Completely dependent on me to get his ticket. All be it free to the club's credit as he was over 80. Must be a few more like him. Rather the old boy's/girl's can still watch the game as anyone would.

In response to Chris who I have spoken privately about this the 2.58 situation? Is the ticket system not internet based? Any number of thing's can go wrong that could cause hold up's. Cash not so in such an event. You have defended your stance on Social media that I have seen but there come's a point it reflects badly on the club when you get ground hoppers and opposition fans's refering to the club as big time charlies or words to the same effect.

One thing not mentioned is I believe the Supporters Club needs to be bought back in some form. The views of some supporters needs representation in these times when not all have internet access and there is the problem in itself. Len made a condition that anyone who wanted to represent fans had to volunteer for matchday duties. I felt that a good move.

I think allowances need to be made if it be registering with the club to allow cash entry or something. The youth are the future but the old folk are the reason we still have a club.

[RST]

Rupert… say the club loses no more than four or five fans per game, which equates to around £1000 per year. More on big games. It doesn’t sound a lot but that’s say 1% of the average crowd? Obviously that’s a figure plucked out of the air, but it could be higher/lower. That’s the cost of convenience.

That's fair enough Neil, but how many people may not come to a game due to bad weather - especially in the scenario of the forecast looking ok a day or two before a game so a fair number of people have bought their tickets in advance only for the forecast to change and, for example, wet weather arrives 12 hours earlier than expected. You could lose an awful lot of Pay on the Day spectators whereas those who have already paid are more likely to put up with the weather and come, or possibly not come, but the club has already received their money.

Also, in the event of postponement, I believe tickets are carried forward to the midweek rearrangement and are not automatically refunded if someone can't go (apologies if this is incorrect, just what I think I have heard). You could easily lose a couple of hundred off the expected gate for the rearrangement, but you would lose less financially if people have already bought their tickets. Some people would couldn't attend the rearrangement might well just write off the money and see it as a donation to the club anyway.

I seem to remember we lost our New Year's Day game against Peterborough Sports last season due to them pulling out blaming Covid. In that case the game was fortunately rearranged for a spare Saturday in March, so we had a healthy attendance, but had that been played on a winter Monday evening you could well have been looking at a considerable drop in expected attendance compared to New Year's Day.

I suggest that two or three (not unlikely) occurrences of these aforementioned scenarios would result in a more financially beneficial outcome for the club over the course of the season than the four or five people who don't come to each game.

As mentioned in my previous post, it's extremely difficult to accurately know how each system would work out without that parallel universe to compare.

If nothing else, this topic has got the forum buzzing with a healthy and well mannered debate!

[Chris_N]

Waited for other comments before I came in.

Speaking from personal experience I took a old boy relative who we lost last year to games. Without me he wouldn't have had a hope of getting a ticket. No internet savvy whatsoever. Completely dependent on me to get his ticket. All be it free to the club's credit as he was over 80. Must be a few more like him. Rather the old boy's/girl's can still watch the game as anyone would.

In response to Chris who I have spoken privately about this the 2.58 situation? Is the ticket system not internet based? Any number of thing's can go wrong that could cause hold up's. Cash not so in such an event. You have defended your stance on Social media that I have seen but there come's a point it reflects badly on the club when you get ground hoppers and opposition fans's refering to the club as big time charlies or words to the same effect.

One thing not mentioned is I believe the Supporters Club needs to be bought back in some form. The views of some supporters needs representation in these times when not all have internet access and there is the problem in itself. Len made a condition that anyone who wanted to represent fans had to volunteer for matchday duties. I felt that a good move.

I think allowances need to be made if it be registering with the club to allow cash entry or something. The youth are the future but the old folk are the reason we still have a club.

[Chris_N]

In response to Chris who I have spoken privately about this the 2.58 situation? Is the ticket system not internet based? Any number of thing's can go wrong that could cause hold up's.

Did you? Don't remember. Yes the ticketing system is internet based - if the internet went down at 2:58, it would stop people buying from the Box Office but would not stop those who had already bought a ticket entering the ground. Another good case for buying in advance. But it would stop card payments if you had those as well.

Cash not so in such an event.

But then if people are presenting already bought tickets and not paying on the turnstiles, cash is not an issue. Cash causes queues and quite honestly, in the current economic situation, leaves volunteers open to temptation.I remember a case in the 1990s (before my involvement) when a volunteer's services were dispensed with because let's say, takings handed in did not balance with the amount of programmes handed out - on a regular basis. Not having cash protects volunteers in more ways than one.

You have defended your stance on Social media that I have seen

Wasn't about defending my stance - it was about pointing out the realities of ground entry on match days and the same half a dozen people being there game in, game out to make it as comfortable and easy as possible. And to be honest, that was achieved last season.

but there come's a point it reflects badly on the club when you get ground hoppers and opposition fans's referring to the club as big time charlies or words to the same effect.

So I guess that makes every concern that uses a ticket entry system as their means of controlling entry to an event or venue a Big Time Charlie!

One thing not mentioned is I believe the Supporters Club needs to be bought back in some form. The views of some supporters needs representation in these times when not all have internet access and there is the problem in itself.

This one's for another thread.

made a condition that anyone who wanted to represent fans had to volunteer for matchday duties. I felt that a good move.

I think you would have been in a distinct minority. That in itself was a massive problem - one person making conditions. The very few who did represent the "Supporters" club most of the time never got to watch matches. The culture and atmosphere at the club has moved on since then Darren.....massively. Again, a separate issue.

I think allowances need to be made if it be registering with the club to allow cash entry or something. The youth are the future but the old folk are the reason we still have a club.

Cash is a backward step. You need to look forwards Darren and in making business considerations, all factors have to be taken into and you go with the best options. Yes of course the old folk are the reason we still have a club, but then it is about helping them to adapt. Not just here but there are changes in all walks of life. Again, end results are easy to suggest but 99% of the time people don't think through the implications of doing things or how you do them.

[Rick]

I get what RST has said and that does make sense. However RST theory hasn’t been expressed by the club I believe? I may be wrong.

Chris seems to go on about a long wait getting into the ground. This also makes sense in decision making. In reality how long does it take to take a card payment? Maybe make it only contactless payment. A contactless payment is no longer than scanning one’s phone or piece of paper.

[DarrenW]

In response to Chris who I have spoken privately about this the 2.58 situation? Is the ticket system not internet based? Any number of thing's can go wrong that could cause hold up's.

Did you? Don't remember. Yes the ticketing system is internet based - if the internet went down at 2:58, it would stop people buying from the Box Office but would not stop those who had already bought a ticket entering the ground. Another good case for buying in advance. But it would stop card payments if you had those as well.

Cash not so in such an event.

But then if people are presenting already bought tickets and not paying on the turnstiles, cash is not an issue. Cash causes queues and quite honestly, in the current economic situation, leaves volunteers open to temptation.I remember a case in the 1990s (before my involvement) when a volunteer's services were dispensed with because let's say, takings handed in did not balance with the amount of programmes handed out - on a regular basis. Not having cash protects volunteers in more ways than one.

You have defended your stance on Social media that I have seen

Wasn't about defending my stance - it was about pointing out the realities of ground entry on match days and the same half a dozen people being there game in, game out to make it as comfortable and easy as possible. And to be honest, that was achieved last season.

but there come's a point it reflects badly on the club when you get ground hoppers and opposition fans's referring to the club as big time charlies or words to the same effect.

So I guess that makes every concern that uses a ticket entry system as their means of controlling entry to an event or venue a Big Time Charlie!

One thing not mentioned is I believe the Supporters Club needs to be bought back in some form. The views of some supporters needs representation in these times when not all have internet access and there is the problem in itself.

This one's for another thread.

made a condition that anyone who wanted to represent fans had to volunteer for matchday duties. I felt that a good move.

I think you would have been in a distinct minority. That in itself was a massive problem - one person making conditions. The very few who did represent the "Supporters" club most of the time never got to watch matches. The culture and atmosphere at the club has moved on since then Darren.....massively. Again, a separate issue.

I think allowances need to be made if it be registering with the club to allow cash entry or something. The youth are the future but the old folk are the reason we still have a club.

Cash is a backward step. You need to look forwards Darren and in making business considerations, all factors have to be taken into and you go with the best options. Yes of course the old folk are the reason we still have a club, but then it is about helping them to adapt. Not just here but there are changes in all walks of life. Again, end results are easy to suggest but 99% of the time people don't think through the implications of doing things or how you do them.

Thanks for your detailed response to each point Chris.

I was referring to when you first mentioned that you did not intend going back to cash entry awhile go and voiced my opposition then over a pint. Possibly at Halesowen earlier in the season. Not directly in response to your 2.58 quote which was my bad wording.

It's a good debate but rather than giving a long winded reply as feel ive made my feeling's known. Would it not be right to have supporter representation with the club again? as feel there is a significant % that take's issue with the new format or simply do not come to games anymore? Another matter perhaps but I do think it highlights we need middle ground between the club and supporters.

Sent you a pm Chris.